Monday, January 15, 2007

Climate Change Hysteria

Take your pick:

Experts say global warming could spread disease
Climate change killed golden civilisations
Climate change brings back malaria
EU’s grim climate change warning
Climate change brings butterfly invasion
Cold comfort in climate change
Scotland’s natural heritage: a victim of global warming
Suckling: An icon for climate change: The polar bear
Climate change will 'wreak havoc in NSW'
Climate And The Animal Kingdom
Climate change nearing point of no return
Canadians waiting for winter, wondering how it will affect national identity
Climate change: The crack of doom?
Reduce CO2 in Ten Years, or Climate Will be Out-of-Control
Combating global warming and climate change: A matter of urgency
Nevergreens? State's signature trees could be lost to climate change
Climate change causing loss of Thai coastline
Climate Change May Put Polar Bear on Threatened List
Climate Change: Rising Seas creates 70,000 Climate Refugees
The fatal adventure of humankind: Climate change
Climate change threatens Herschel Island
Climate change a killer
Climate Change Submerges it's First Inhabited Island
Climate change at crisis level
Oceans Warming And Rising
Prince Charles: Climate change is 'biggest threat to mankind'
Climate change is turning animals' world topsy-turvy
Grim prognosis for Earth
Climate change 'could kill off Alpine skiing'
Climate Change Melts Kilimanjaro's Snows Just so happens my sister was just there. Here is a picture she took while on top of Kili...

Kilimanjaro

And they wonder why some people are frightened and some are skeptic.... No Media Hype here.....

Update for the non believers of the above pic....

Linda on top of Kili More of my big sis's pics can be seen at Linda Travels, her photo Blog.

17 comments:

Candace said...

Hey! Don't go confusing me with the facts. And just because you SAY your sister took this picture, well, geez... Is she an AP accredited photographer? No? hmmm

Zorpheous said...

Or we could run around with our heads cut off and scream about how Gays Marrages will destroy our society and lead to cats and dogs sleeping together,...

aka,..

We need a lot less hot air and a lot more level headed thinking.

Tim said...

Now your just being silly Zorph a Dog would never sleep with a cat, they have better taste than that!

Tim said...

Okay Candace I will update with further proof...lol. Although , no, she is not an approved AP photographer. She is far better than they are. ;)

Zorpheous said...

very cool dude

Tim said...

Actually Zorph...she was froze... she hates winter thus why she now lives in the Caribean.... You would like her, she is a diving instructor out there and a world traveler.

Gayle said...

ABF posted about your sisters pictures so I came over here to see. Yep... that sure looks like snow to me, and a lot of it.

Global warming has really been confused this year. I have icicles hanging from my roof and I had to use a hair dryer this morning to defrost the keyhole in the trunk so I could open it. This type of weather in Central Texas really convinces me that Global Warming is a fact. LOL!

Tim said...

Thanks for poping by Gayle. Icicles in Texas is one of the reasons that the Church of Climate Change, no longer calls it "global warming". "Climate Change" is sooooo much easier to prove, OH OH OH It's getting warmer...OH OH OH, its getting cooler... OH OH OH, the sky is falling the sky is falling.... they are always right this way....

Arminius Cheruski said...

Yup, that's real convincing, a one time photo really shows me there is a lot more snow, or the same, as there was 10, 20 and 50 yrs ago.

This simple holiday snap is definitely proof that all those scientific studies and series of photos done over decades by hundreds of people are completely wrong.

ie Of course no one is saying that the glaciers on Kilimanjaro are already gone, just that they are going. for eg http://www.esri.com/mapmuseum/mapbook_gallery/volume20/conservation2.html
Something a one time photo is completely and utterly irrelevant to show or disprove.

I really cannot find the language to express how utterly disingenuous, dishonest and ridiculous your whole premise is.

Tim said...

"I really cannot find the language to express how utterly disingenuous, dishonest and ridiculous your whole premise is."

My whole premise? Did you read the title of this post? Did you read any of the articles I linked to? The way they read is more disingenious and dishonest than any premise you seemed to have percieved from what little I have written here. All the extremists are running around filling peoples heads with misinformation by simply not giving us ALL the facts. A little vague here a little vague there... but thats okay when it suits you agenda....

Arminius Cheruski said...

"Did you read the title of ... "

I am delighted to be specific, highly specific.

1) The links you post are to the Hindu Time, The Financial Post, CTV, Times On-Line, CBS etc. In other words these are what a reporter and editor say about climate change, not what climate change scientists have to say.

2) Why not link directly to sites of scientists and scientific organizations such as http://www.ucsusa.org/global_warming/ and get the facts unfiltered by journalists?

3) What, in particular, in any of the stories in question, would you consider constitutes "...ALL the facts."

4) What parts of the IPCC http://www.ipcc.ch/ report do you have concerns about? please indicate specific sections.

5) What problems do you see with the science - please name the researcher and the work in question.

I look forward to your answers ...

Tim said...

Let me spell it out for you Arminius Cheruski as you seem to be confusing two seperate things here. I am not quoting scientists here as this post is about the hysteria created by the "MEDIA"! Thus why I have provided many links to the "MEDIA" that is creating the "HYSTERIA" over this issue. All of a sudden, if a flea dies on the back of a dog, the "MEDIA" will blame that on "CLIMATE CHANGE" everything that happens now, according to our "MEDIA" is connected to "CLIMATE CHANGE". The way the "MEDIA" reported/reports about Kili, is as if the glaciers ARE completely gone. Now unlike yourself, where do you think most people get their "facts" from? Dare I say some form of "MEDIA". My posting of my sisters pics on Kili are just as informative as anything the "MEDIA" puts out. Have a nice evening....

Hermann der Cherusker said...

Actually I get my facts from the scientific journals and from scientists ... really not that unusual for a biologist.

If anything the media is still underplaying how serious climate change is and what the implications are. All of this was generally known by the late 80s, but then organizations like the IPCC are influenced by their governments and hence quite conservative; there is nothing in the IPCC report that wasn't generally accepted in the scientific community by 1990.

And of course there is the fact that the US government has been actively interfering with the work of its own scientists to suppress evidence relevant to climate change http://www.boston.com/news/local/vermont/articles/2007/01/31/welch_interference_in_science_stunning/?p1=MEWell_Pos4 while industry has been hiring prostitutes to lie to you http://www.guardian.co.uk/frontpage/story/0,,2004399,00.html.

Do you happen to know of a single peer reviewed scientific paper that questioned human caused climate change published since 1993? Out of tens of thousands published on climate change I know of none and I would be curious.

"The way the "MEDIA" reported/reports about Kili, is as if the glaciers ARE completely gone." Please provide a link or reference (name & date) to any media that has made such a claim.

re: your sister's picture. So if I provide a photo of some Cdn soldiers relaxing in Afghanistan it proves there are no Taliban? An absurd suggestion of course, but on a par with the allegation that the picture you post demonstrates anything.

Tim said...

"Actually I get my facts from the scientific journals and from scientists ... really not that unusual for a biologist."

Which just goes to prove my point that you are not reading anything here... I spelled it out for you and even stated

"Now unlike yourself, where do you think most people get their "facts" from?"

So by your statement above, am I supposed to exstrapilate that "most" people are biologists?

You can throw all the links you want at me. Huff and puff all you like, it is not going to change a thing here or my point of view as you continue to miss the point of this post.

As far as your "peer reviewed" scientific papers... can you explain to me how the well known "hockey stick" graph ever passed such a review when it was garbage from the day it was contrived? Eliminating data to get the results you want is exceptable by science these days is it? One other thing I would like to know is, when did man come up with a computer and a program that can accurately combine all of the thousands of variables that effect our climate and come to the conclusions that it is man made?

Never mind I already know the answer. Now if you care to give me some solutions to the problem that don't involve buying credits from other countries, that will actually clean up our enviroment and at the same time not kill our economy in one fell swoop...I am all ears. Personally I don't know of anyone that is willing to give up their job, or drastically change their way of life to accomplish this task, do you? Or better yet, would you?

I do my part for the enviroment on a daily basis. I do not waste electricity, I recycle, I produce about 1 bag of garbage per month from my home. I drive a compact vehicle that gets great fuel millage. It is 14 years old and only has 138,000 kms on it so as you can see I don't drive around excesively. I have renovated my home to have superior insulating abilities including windows and doors. My furnace is next to be replaced with a more effifient one. After that I will be exchanging the hot water tank to an on demand style rather than a tank. As it is my thermastat is kept well below the average household, mine is set at 17 degrees celcius. I am an avid outdoorsman and I take care of the enviroment by cleaning up after others on a regular basis. Nothing bothers me more than going into the wilderness on a trip only to find garbage thrown about and left behind by other who could care less.

So now if you would like to continue preaching please find someone who will listen or whom actuall needs to be preached at. I have said it enough times. Just because one does not believe in the whole man made climate change fiasco/hysteria/kyoto thing does not make them anti enviroment or anti polution. Take a look how well our governments are doing on solving our problems. Even the so called "green" politicians can only argue about who did and did not do what when or how. They are a complete joke.

Have a great day!

Tim said...

PS... I am looking forward to hear your solutions... They surely must be better than anything I, or the government( both ruling and oppositions) are currently doing.

Hermann der Cherusker said...

"that you are not reading anything here..."

I have read what is here, what I said was " ... I get my facts from ..."

" So by your statement above" Actually you are responding to one of your own comments, that's why it makes no sense.

" ... as you continue to miss the point of this post."

I get the point quite clearly; you want people to believe that climate change is not to be taken seriously and as "proof" you offer a one time photo of Mount Kilimanjaro and imply that the amount of ice and snow has not changed significantly regardless of what the media or scientists say. My point is that you are being dishonest and disingenous.

If your point was accurate you could make it using actual data and series of photos taken over time. Presumably you do not because any fair presentation of the facts would completely discredit you 'point'.

" As far as your "peer reviewed" scientific papers... from the day it was contrived? "

And what exactly is your problem with the now outdated model?


"Eliminating data to get the results you want is exceptable by science these days is it? "

No, it is not acceptable, nor was it done. Removing data that can be shown to be corrupt for one reason or another is not only acceptable, it is necessary.


"One other thing I would like to know is,...conclusions that it is man made?"

No one has said it was man made. Human influenced, yes - but not man made.

"Never mind I already know the answer. "

Do you? a little arrogant, don't you think?

"Now if you care to give me some solutions to the problem that don't involve buying credits from other countries, that will actually clean up our enviroment and at the same time not kill our economy in one fell swoop...I am all ears."

Carbon credits are a sham, I agree. Other than that, same answer as the answer to these questions:

1) How can I keep drinking gin all day, stay healthy and not lose my job and family?
2) How can I smoke 3 packs a day and not have this lung cancer get worse? etc

If you change nothinig, nothing will change. And as with these examples, the consequences of not changing anything are totally predictable. We are dealing with physical realities here, not negotiables.

"Personally I don't know of anyone that is willing to give up their job, or drastically change their way of life to accomplish this task, do you? Or better yet, would you?"

I already have. I left research science to work on these problems at a social and educational level 20 years ago. I got rid of my vehicle in the mid-80s when what was happening to the planet was undeniable and have not owned or operated one since. I became vegetarian in '89 and stopped flying around 2000. etc Any less would be hypocritical, no?

I do my part for the enviroment on a daily basis .... who could care less.

Good for you, but my point stands. If we are unwilling to change the consequences are as predictable as they are for the heavy smoker and alcoholic. Geophysical realities have no way of caring what we are or are not willing to do. Like the addict, we can choose to save ourselves of not. Everything else is irrelevant.

So now if you would like to continue preaching"

I have not been preaching, I noted that your posting is deliberately misleading and have asked you to substantiate and provide real data to support your point. You have neither shown the former to be incorrect, nor provided the latter.

If I am the one who is so wrong you should have no trouble doing both.

"Take a look how well our governments are doing on solving our problems.

Have I suggested they are doing anything worth mentioning?

"PS... I am looking forward to hear your solutions... "

As noted wrt to all addictions, the solution is obvious if you are serious, and there is no solution if you are not. So far we most emphatically are not ...

Hermann der Cherusker said...

Tim

You had some concerns about the "hockey stick". Hopefully these can answer your questions:

"4. Is there legitimate scientific debate about the accuracy of the hockey stick graph?"
http://www.realclimate.org/index.php?p=121
http://www.ucsusa.org/global_warming/science/hockeystickFAQ.html
http://www.realclimate.org/index.php?p=11